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TrojanMindSC	Controversial Subject: Should USC basketball self-impose NCAA penalties?		Lead	[-]
Posts: 874 06/01/09 10:03 PM	Tags : None The first issue is Floyd's alleged payments. IMO USC should do nothing about this as I don't believe it is true or that the NCAA can penalize USC without more factual evidence. However with regards to Mayo receiving benefits, should USC self-impose a penalty for failure to monitor Mayo? Why should USC self-impose a penalty? 1)I think it will be pretty easy to prove Guillory provided Mayo with benefits and that USC allowed Guillory to be around the program to a degree. Even if USC didn't know about the benefits, the NCAA will still make USC forfeit wins from that season. 2) Without even being penalized, the cloud over the program is doing enough damage. Why prolong the damage even if the NCAA decides against major penalties? Be proactive so that future recruits know that when they are at SC, SC won't be on probation. 3) Next years team will be fighting with Stanford for 10th place, any-type of self imposed post-season ban or scholarship reduction won't really matter. Basically IMO USC should sacrifice next year for the long term good rather than have to sacrifice the next couple of year as USC waits to find out the results of the investigation and is handcuffed in recruiting.
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USC415		#1	[url]	[-]
Posts: 21 06/01/09 10:34 PM	If we we're to self-impose, taking away possible postseason berths is not the answer, IMO. That would not be fair to Dwight Lewis, possibly our only returning senior next year. The possibly of playing in the NCAA's is a huge motivating factor for teams and players. Let the NCAA do that if they want to. Maybe we could limit our scholarships for 2 or 3 years. My principal worry is our 2010 recruiting class. So far we've got Franklin and Polee verbally committed. I assume Polee's dad is still employed by Floyd so he's probably safe. I do wonder about Franklin, though. He reportedly told people at the Pangos Camp he's still solid with SC, but who knows how he'll feel in a few months. After that, who else can we get? Bryce Jones, maybe? Recruits are starting to avoid mentioning SC in their lists, and you'd have to think the cloud of the allegations will have a continued effect on future recruiting until this whole thing is settled. I know Sleuth mentioned Harrison Barnes visiting a few threads down, but the only way we get him is if we pay him (pun intended). Basically, we have no shot.
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Turkued		#2	[url]	[-]
Posts: 279 06/02/09 3:06 AM	No. U.S.C. can not concede anything to the N.C.A.A. The University is doing the right thing by getting the lawyers involved early and preparing to challenge any N.C.A.A. violation in court. It may cost us next year, it may cost us a few years but some things are more important than wins on the court. When a player enrolls at a University he does not lose his right to free association. What right does USC or the NCAA have to tell O.J. Mayo who he can or can not associate with off the court? You have the rules, you monitor things to see if the rules are broken and in this case no one has proven anything. When a player enrolls at a University his parents do not lose the right of free association and USC and the NCAA have no right to investigate them. Did Reggie Bush make an agreement to do x if y occurred to his parents? I have seen no evidence showing that. Bush is no more responsible for his parent's acts than Jimmy Carter was for Billy Carter. My fear is USC will give into NCAA pressure, will dump the Coach... If so, Tim Floyd meet Joseph Murray. Murray is Jim O'Brien's lawyer and Jim will soon be collecting close to $12 million from Ohio State. Given the rather expansive nature of California monetary awards, as compared to Ohio, can you say "Floyd Hall", "Floyd Center". "Floyd Park", "Floyd University?" Loyalty and support pays in many ways. It is in USC's self interest to support it's coaches, support it's student athletes past and present and give minimal cooperation to the NCAA. Let there be no mistake: the NCAA will try to do something. When they do USC needs to respond in Superior Court. You do not give into bullies. The NCAA is a monopoly that is out of control. Fortunately they rarely win in court. Admit nothing, say nothing. Win forever, on court and in the court. It's the right thing to do, it's the smart thing to do, it's the American thing to do. In the Trojan Family we do not throw our family members overboard to appease people from Indiana. A state that gives us both Notre Dame and the N.C.A.A. A very bad state.
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wstrojan	Something Needs to Be Done	#3	[url]	[-]
Posts: 420 06/02/09 7:20 AM	We can talk all we want about the NCAA having nothing, this all being lies, etc - and that all may be the case, but that's really neither the perception nor reality at this point. We are losing players and recruits left and right. I really can't believe it has come to this - you guys do realize that now 4 players have gone pro, and our top 4 recruits once Momo leaves will have all left. That's 8 players.
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falvidre	Nope.....	#4	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1246 06/02/09 7:24 AM	Stay the course.
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aspentrojan	the real issue is the nature of ncaa to do things that have no relationship	#5	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1177 06/02/09 7:28 AM	to the law or many times common sense. I can only hope that usc spares nothing in their defense - in the mean time we have to wait for the infractions committee to meet this summer of all. This Kurt Street guy is a poor replacement for A, J. Andande. It is his position that Floyd should be shouting his innocence from the mountain tops and defy all the usc lawyers and administation.
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SoCalHoopFan	NCAA is already getting their way	#6	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2329 06/02/09 8:33 AM	It makes no difference what USC does at this point. You think the NCAA doesn't realize what the pending investigation is doing to USC? You don't think it intentinonal that by merely dragging out an investigation of USC that we have lost recruits and even released kids from their LOIs? This is a bureaucrat's way of getting the outcome they want when frustrated by their inability to get the proof they need to actually impose sanctions.
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WestsideTrojan1	Turkued, you are right sir.	#7	[url]	[-]
Posts: 229 06/02/09 9:35 AM	To anyone who wants to quit out there, please read Turkued's synopsis. He spells it out quite nicely. Self imposed sanctions are an admission of guilt. For those of you who are feeling a little overcome... remember, it is "FIGHT on!" not "FLIGHT on!"
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DFWTrojan		#8	[url]	[-]
Posts: 157 06/02/09 10:25 AM	The only thing that I can defer from all of the player defections is that rumors are strong on campus that SC is buying out Floyd. That seems to be the only rational explanation for all of the inexplicable player behavior. And, bagging the coach is essential a self-imposed sanction, especially this late in the year. But, if true, why in the heck wait so long? And, if not true, then why are ALL of the players bolting?
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ChaseinManhattan	Self-imposed penalties have not deterred the NCAA. The question that should be asked is...	#9	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1476 06/02/09 10:41 AM	Whose head goes on the chopping block. Let's start with the most obvious; The Athletic Director (MG) The GC (Amir) and all senior staff in the GC's office the directors of compliance. The only real question in my mind is whether Sample should go as well for hiring these people.
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DFWTrojan		#10	[url]	[-]
Posts: 157 06/02/09 12:57 PM	meant "infer" instead of "defer". duh. blogging from the office can be hazardous.
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wstrojan	Socal Hoop Fan has it right - we're already being punished	#11	[url]	[-]
Posts: 420 06/02/09 2:23 PM	What's a worse punishment then gutting a roster and essentially wiping out an entire recruiting class, setting a team back years? That's what has happened. What a perfect way for the NCAA to hammer people when they have no actual means of doing it through things like proof, etc. Ridiculous that by feeding a media frenzy they can basically cripple a program. This is ridiculous - this stuff either happened, or it didn't. People will either talk to you, or they'll stonewall you. If this is going to be the NCAA's modus operandi going forward, then they had better apply it across the board.
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DFWTrojan		#12	[url]	[-]
Posts: 157 06/02/09 2:26 PM	Justice delayed is justice denied.
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TrojanMindSC		#13	[url]	[-]
Posts: 874 06/02/09 2:36 PM	WestsideTrojan1 wrote: Self imposed sanctions are an admission of guilt. Are they? If USC says Mayo received benefits from a source not associated with the university and without the university knowing, what has USC really admitting guilt to? Mayo can be guilty of receiving benefits without USC being guilty of anything. They just declare Mayo ineligible and forfeit the wins. The NCAA has shown leniency for programs that self-impose penalties, even if it just forfeiting wins.
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WestsideTrojan1		#14	[url]	[-]
Posts: 229 06/02/09 4:36 PM	TrojanMindSC wrote: WestsideTrojan1 wrote: Self imposed sanctions are an admission of guilt. Are they? If USC says Mayo received benefits from a source not associated with the university and without the university knowing, what has USC really admitting guilt to? Mayo can be guilty of receiving benefits without USC being guilty of anything. They just declare Mayo ineligible and forfeit the wins. The NCAA has shown leniency for programs that self-impose penalties, even if it just forfeiting wins. Yes sir. In your example SC would be admitting guilt of using an ineligible player. My argument would be 1. Prove to me he was ineligible. 2. If proven ineligible, show me how SC knew this and used him anyway, or show me they were negligent in their investigation before using him. Being that both the NCAA and SC did a lot of homework in this case, negligence might be tough to show. Fight on!
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Turkued		#15	[url]	[-]
Posts: 279 06/02/09 4:38 PM	1. You are assuming O.J. Mayo received improper benefits. I make no such assumption. What benefits are involved? Rumors exist of a TV. Was there a quid pro quo? Apparently not as I see no benefits conferred on the accusers by O.J. If the T.V. existed and was a gift from family or friends that had no connection to O.J.'s athletic status: no violation. 2. Can a friend give another friend a gift? Was there a preexisting relationship? Is the gift related to sport? As noted previously, the NBA tickets given Mayo by Anthony were reported to the NCAA by USC. The NCAA declared it a secondary violation and O.J. had to give the NCAA $460 to maintain his eligibility. IMHO USC should not have reported the incident and should have challenged the ruling. There is no violation if the tickets came from a friend. Carmelo and O.J. were friend's. James Dunleavy can get tickets from his Dad and bring his teammates. Although I would not advise it. 3. One of the things that really ticks me off about this whole thing is who O.J. was at USC. He's a kid who scored a 29 on the ACT. He intellectually belonged on a college campus. He's a kid who went to class and barely missed making the Dean's list.While here he was actually a student athlete. Imagine that. Of course, as a black kid from a broken home I guess that must make the NCAA suspicious as well. Last Edited By: Turkued 06/02/09 4:43 PM. Edited 3 times.
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ChaseinManhattan	"THE ONLY QUESTION THAT SHOULD BE ASKED IS WHOSE HAD GOES ON THE CHOPPING BLOCK FIRST"	#16	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1476 06/09/09 5:58 PM	ChaseinManhattan wrote: Whose head goes on the chopping block. Let's start with the most obvious; The Athletic Director (MG) The GC (Amir) and all senior staff in the GC's office the directors of compliance. The only real question in my mind is whether Sample should go as well for hiring these people. If anything, I was understating the issue last week at this time. This has been a clusterf*(k of astronomical scale by this Administration. The house must be cleaned....starting at the top (Sample).
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Controversial Subject: Should USC basketball self-impose NCAA penalties?	06/01/09 10:03 PM	TrojanMindSC
Re: Controversial Subject: Should USC basketball self-impose NCAA penalties?	06/01/09 10:34 PM	USC415
Re: Controversial Subject: Should USC basketball self-impose NCAA penalties?	06/02/09 3:06 AM	Turkued
Something Needs to Be Done	06/02/09 7:20 AM	wstrojan
Nope.....	06/02/09 7:24 AM	falvidre
the real issue is the nature of ncaa to do things that have no relationship	06/02/09 7:28 AM	aspentrojan
NCAA is already getting their way	06/02/09 8:33 AM	SoCalHoopFan
Turkued, you are right sir.	06/02/09 9:35 AM	WestsideTrojan1
Re: Controversial Subject: Should USC basketball self-impose NCAA penalties?	06/02/09 2:36 PM	TrojanMindSC
Re: Controversial Subject: Should USC basketball self-impose NCAA penalties?	06/02/09 4:36 PM	WestsideTrojan1
Re: Controversial Subject: Should USC basketball self-impose NCAA penalties?	06/02/09 10:25 AM	DFWTrojan
Self-imposed penalties have not deterred the NCAA. The question that should be asked is...	06/02/09 10:41 AM	ChaseinManhattan
Re: Controversial Subject: Should USC basketball self-impose NCAA penalties?	06/02/09 12:57 PM	DFWTrojan
"THE ONLY QUESTION THAT SHOULD BE ASKED IS WHOSE HAD GOES ON THE CHOPPING BLOCK FIRST"	06/09/09 5:58 PM	ChaseinManhattan
Socal Hoop Fan has it right - we're already being punished	06/02/09 2:23 PM	wstrojan
Re: Controversial Subject: Should USC basketball self-impose NCAA penalties?	06/02/09 2:26 PM	DFWTrojan
Re: Controversial Subject: Should USC basketball self-impose NCAA penalties?	06/02/09 4:38 PM	Turkued